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Worlds First Scaleless Ball Pythons Produced Yesterday

Discussion in 'Ball Pythons' started by CryHavoc17, Sep 20, 2013.

  1. CryHavoc17

    CryHavoc17 Elite Member

    If you guys haven't heard the news, Brian from BHB (and Snakebytes TV) hatched 3 scaleless ball pythons yesterday. He bred 2 imports that had 90% scaleless heads together and 3 of the babies from that clutch are completely scaleless. Its all over facebook if you follow any of the big breeders. What do you guys think about this project? I know a lot of people who think the scaleless projects go too far. My opinion is that scaleless colubrids have been around long enough for us to know that these animals can thrive in captivity, and as long as the animals thrive I really don't have an issue with it. What do you think? Is this an awesome cutting edge project, or just another example of unethical practices by a top breeder?
     
  2. thinkbig317

    thinkbig317 Elite Member

    I feel the same way. If they are thriving in captivity then by all means! Congrats to Brian @ BHB!
     
  3. Wyldrose

    Wyldrose Elite Member

    It's very exciting to see something new :) I can't wait until they come out of the eggs!! I think they are very neat, and hope they thrive!
     
  4. CryHavoc17

    CryHavoc17 Elite Member

    The things these guys have done with ball pythons over the last 10 years never ceases to amaze me. You would think at some point the species would run out of crazy new colors and patterns, but it seems like it never does
     
  5. Dragoness

    Dragoness Elite Member

    I wonder what a shed from these guys looks like?
     
  6. Thalatte

    Thalatte Elite Member

    Would they even shed? Shed is old scales that they outgrow but no scales means no reason to shed right?
     
  7. Rich

    Rich Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    They will still have skin to shed even if it is scaleless. It should be fairly smooth looking I would presume. lol I am interested in seeing it though when he posts it on Facebook.
     
  8. Runningmom

    Runningmom Elite Member

    What is the facebookpage?
     
  9. CryHavoc17

    CryHavoc17 Elite Member

    Bhb reptiles is the facebook oage. His youtube channel is Snake Bytes TV, I'm sure they will be putting film up soon (side note: snake bytes TV is a great weekly reptile show, basically 10 minutes a week of brian showing off his INSANE collection)
     
  10. Thalatte

    Thalatte Elite Member

    I shall now subscribe to snake bytes tv.

    Do you think they will shed in one piece or will it flake off like dandruff?
     
  11. Wyldrose

    Wyldrose Elite Member

    I think the shed will be thin like geckos shed :)

    I love snake bytes tv! We watched it ever week and love it. He has so many amazing animals and has had so many worlds firsts. He loves his reptiles, not just money :)
     
  12. Dragoness

    Dragoness Elite Member

    Apparently, BHB is located in my state. I may need to have a field trip here soon.
     
  13. Katsura

    Katsura Elite Member

    I watch SnakeBytes every week. Wednesday is my favorite day. Sad that Chews is gone though. :p I am hoping that once I move in early 2014 I will be closer to them so I can visit their facility and maybe pick up an animal or 5. Lol.

    Anyways, on the whole scale less thing, I'm on the fence with it. I don't really like it, but I'm not against it. I don't see the allure of scale less snakes or why anyone would want one or want to make one. They are interesting I guess, but I doubt I'll ever want to have one in my collection. But so long as they are living just as good a life and being just as healthy as a normal, scaled snake, then I suppose there's no problem with it.

    It just isn't my cup of tea, but I am very much excited and happy for Brian for doing this and it's always great to see the hobby moving in different directions.
     
  14. AdamL8

    AdamL8 Elite Member

    I knew that these were in the incubator but I didn't know that they were going to be out so soon. Finally some of these in the hands of a capable breeder. Can't wait to see how they progress.
     
  15. jarich

    jarich Elite Member

    My initial reaction is not positive. It's one thing to breed a certain colour, or pattern, but lacking scales is a major defect. I really don't think I agree with purposely breeding these animals. These are living feeling animals, not some science experiment. Another indication of Bryan's lack of good decision making lately.
     
  16. Dragoness

    Dragoness Elite Member

    If any deviation from normal is a defect, then all of the other morphs are defects as well. Scaleless snakes have sporadically been observed in the wild, so it is just another rare genetic trait that is seldom seen. Like albinism.
     
  17. CryHavoc17

    CryHavoc17 Elite Member

    Its going to be very interesting to see how this shakes out. The couple of other instances of scaleless balls were spontaneous mutations that came loaded down with other birth defects that killed the animals very young. This project however was the intentional result of a specific pairing. I wonder if it will make a difference in the health of the snakes. If these scaleless snakes lack heat pits the the way the derma ball and others have that will place me firmly against breeding these guys
     
  18. AdamL8

    AdamL8 Elite Member

    Special care may be needed but this is not a morph that anybody other than a specialty owner could get their hands on anyways. I believe that I had read that the Derma Ball did actually have heat pits but they were hard to see because of the lack of scales or something to that effect.

    Some people seem to find scaleless animals to be some sort of abomination that shouldn't be reproduced because of the possible complications. In a responsible owners hands these complications are almost entirely eliminated. If the snake can live healthily then there is no reason to not reproduce these types of amazing traits. It's similar to importing an animal from the wild that does not do well in captivity. Certain people are more qualified to take care of these animals and are able to successfully raise them in captivity while others are not prepared or qualified to do so and the animals die as a result.
     
  19. CryHavoc17

    CryHavoc17 Elite Member

    So I know directly linking to youtube isn't permitted here. Just wanted to tell all you guys to head over to youtube and check out the latest episode of snake bytes TV. It shows brian cutting the scaleless eggs live and in real time. Its actually pretty cool to see his reaction. Unfortunately there still aren't any pictures of the babies out of the eggs.... soon I hope!
     

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