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Is This Acceptable To Have Happen?

Discussion in 'Leopard Geckos' started by Owen Baranoski, Nov 23, 2017.

  1. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Just snapped this pic. Is this acceptable? 20171123_111643.jpg
     
  2. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

    Why are you holding the different species so close together?
     
  3. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    That's the point of this post. Is that acceptable?
     
  4. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

    No it`s not acceptable, they are all carnivorous and there`s some significant size differences, meaning the likelyhood of them attacking each other is even greater. Can I ask how much experience you have keeping reptiles?
     
  5. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Enough experience to know that you all failed the test... I was just testing everyones knowledge and low and behold, you all failed. These animals (in a big enough environment, wh) CAN be housed together, and havent ever attacked each other, and have been housed together for a while. There is ZERO chance of an attack, and they all interact very well. There was a very methodical way of introducing them to each other. You've made a fool of yourself by telling me I'm wrong here. Nice try though!
     
  6. AmityReptiles

    AmityReptiles Well Established Member

    That is literally the definition of trolling lol...
    The fact that you house all of those together, which I know atleast half of them are solitary, speaks to your inexperience. You have species mixed that wouldn't be found in a stones throw from each other in the wild, let alone on the same side of the planet!
     
  7. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    That's the truth... I am trolling. They're houses together in an environment with 2 different temperatures. It's got a humid, grassy side, and a hot, arid rocky side for the geckos. I've got an Asian long tail lizard and a green anole, which coincide on the humid side, and the geckos happily live on the rocky, arid side. Sorry to trick you like that, I just had to see what people would say. Thanks for being a good sport though lol
     
  8. AmityReptiles

    AmityReptiles Well Established Member

    Could you post some pics showing how you isolate the two areas making them suitable environments and how you are measuring the temps and humidity in both areas?
     
    Owen Baranoski likes this.
  9. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Here are some pictures of the vivarium. As you can see, the anole/longtail side is on the left, gecko on the right. The heat mat is directly under the rock, and the vent on top is open, so humidity isn't trapped inside for the gecko's side. The left side traps heat and humidity from the grass and moss and and mud heating up, along with a mist spray. The gecko side is about 35% humidity, and the rock is very warm. The left side is a much higher humidity, perfect for the tropical lizards. Their vent is closed, retaining humidity. It also gets rid of the need for a humidity hide. I have an entire humidity SIDE. Their are also 6 hides, 3 branches, and a calcium, food, and water dish. Also free range crickets. If there are any suggestions, please make them! There is multiple grasses for the lizards, which the longtail adores. As you can tell, this setup is superb for what I'm using it for. If you've got criticism, lay it on me!! 1511488142209431335633.jpg 15114881822222071827826.jpg 15114880845991628011885.jpg
     
  10. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Yeah I was typing and uploading pictures as you responded. They are up.
     
  11. AmityReptiles

    AmityReptiles Well Established Member

    Criticism aside, I can tell you have put alot of thought into this, and it looks like a very well made custom top you have created.(did you make it?)
    Do you have any hygrometers or thermometers? Is your heat mat regulated with a t-stat? If you only have one heating element, it seems that the humid lizards would have to go to the dry arid side to bask and warm themselves or vice versa? Which side is the heat pad On? And what size is your enclosure? How do you keep them from escaping with one side completely open? How do you feed them so they don't compete over food?
    Sorry for all the questions. I keep all of my animals separate, so I enjoy hearing what other keepers do to overcome the problems of cohabbing.
     
  12. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    No worries! I love talking about my set up to people who actually care. The secret is the plexiglass lid, the 40 gallon heat mat, and the rock size. The rock actually only takes up 75 percent of the heat mat. The mat extend over to the moss and grass, heating it, and creating a humidity for the anole side. It essentially traps the temperate under the plexiglass, but not on the ventilated side. That's the beauty of it. The only one who could escape is the anole, and the only reason he can't is because there's a little ledge of wood on the inside he can't climb. I don't know why he can't, but he just doesn't. The food bit isn't an issue either. The geckos eat mealsorms, crickets, and waxworms. The other two just eat crickets. The real key here is buying lots of crickets. Since the grass is all alive, they burrow down and come out when hungry. That's when the lizards get them. It's essentially a timed system. The only thing I don't have are the humidity gauges, or temperature gauges. I'm getting some tomorrow though. All of the reptiles show signs of good health, so I believe everything is fine, climate wise. I have a little log mossy bridge over the rock and heat pad for the anole and long tail, which keeps them moist while they bask. It is a 50 gallon aquarium, but the 40 gallon heating pad is more than enough since the plastic lid retains heat so well. I'll upload more pictures in a separate post. And yes my father and I made the lid by hand.
     
  13. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    The lid rests inside the tank, so they'd have to clump upside down, which they apparently dont... lol. I suppose the anole could escape, but he hasn't, and he has had LOTS of chances to. Maybe he just can't. Here's a picture of the bridge ,too. In the one picture, you can see the two humid lizards on the arid side, basking. If you look closely you can see my tremper albino gecko sleeping in the hide on the rock... I would recommend this setup, but it's really tough to do if you don't have a proper lid, and the right lizards. I tried it with milk snakes before this. Let's just say this was a fail the first time around. Cohabitation really is one of my favorite things but most of you herps frown upon it. If you do it properly, not much can go wrong. 1511491107414585538040.jpg 1511490897824221817353.jpg 151149097708187878847.jpg
     
  14. Qwerty3159

    Qwerty3159 Elite Member

    Those first two sentences are pretty much the exact reason it's frowned upon. When you say you tried mixing milk snakes and that it "failed" am I correct in guessing one ate or tried to eat the other resulting in the death of both or one of the snakes involved?
    I see you put a lot of effort into your setup but it is still in my opinion completely unsuitable, and I see no real benefit of combining species from different environments and continents. The enclosure is hardly suitable even for the anole, who would benefit not only from more branches an options to get higher in the enclosure but also UVB lighting which it doesn't seem that you have, let alone the other three animals. I noticed you gave percentages for humidity and some temperatures but you also said you didn't have anything to measure those perameters with. How are you sure that the conditions are optimal for any of the animals?
    Your leopard geckos are only juveniles. As they grow they will become much larger than the anole or grass lizard. You are wrong in suggesting there is zero chance of a conflict between the animals. It would take one mistake on the part of one of the geckos to lunge at one of the smaller lizards and grab it, possibly fatally injuring it. Letting crickets run around in the cage is not good for the animals because when they get hungry they'll tend to bite your lizards.
     
    Last edited: Nov 24, 2017
  15. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Not going to argue with you about this any more because to be completely honest, it's a bit silly at this point... both the milk snakes are still alive, I just had to move them to a 20 gallon tank. I tried controlled tests with cohabbing them with the longtail, which worked just fine for 3 weeks. The reason I had to change was when we made the lid, I had to change from a heat lamp to a heat mat, so I had to switch the bedding from aspen so the snakes wouldn't burrow down. I also wanted to diversify my species, and milk snakes just wouldn't do. Don't worry, they are both alive and well.
     
  16. AmityReptiles

    AmityReptiles Well Established Member

    Not intending to argue with you, just want you to be aware of some things to watch out for...
    The fact they aren't fighting could be either a sign of lethargy, stress, or they might be waiting for the right moment... these aren't communal animals, they are solitary. So they will undoubtedly fight over territory.
    Just things to watch out for, they are likely stressed, which might not manifest for a while even if they never fight. One day one of the lizards will stop eating, and you will visibly see health decline. I understand you have taken this from a scientific perspective, experiments and trial and error, which is commendable. But you haven't had a long enough period of time to see the full repercussions of your experiment, everything may be fine now, but that will change at some point. Most of us have that same scientific perspective atleast, but trust your colleagues that have had long term Ill effects from what you're trying, and build from there. We don't need to make every mistake our fellow herpers have, that's why we have this website! :)
     
  17. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Thank you for being polite about it. I understand where you are coming from. A lot of people here can by very rude. The two humid lizards were both labeled as communal. If they begin to have health issues, I will separate them. Thanks for your opinions though. I really do appreciate it. The other thing is that the geckos are nocturnal and the small lizards are active in the daytime. When the lizards sleep, they sleep in the sticks, which the geckos don't climb. The chance for attack is quite slim...
     
  18. AmityReptiles

    AmityReptiles Well Established Member

    When I said solitary I was saying as far as outside their species. Anoles and ltl's are communal as respects their own individual species, but you wouldn't find an anole riding his pet bearded dragon in the wild! They would commune with other anoles though. Thanks for listening and watching out, I hope the best of health to you and your animals.
     
  19. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Thanks... that anole bearded dragon bit gave me a solid laugh. Best of luck with your reptiles as well!!
     
  20. Owen Baranoski

    Owen Baranoski Well-Known Member

    Hey, took your advice. Added a UVB fixture, and added a big branch with lots of sticks for the anole, while leaving space for the geckos the anole seems much happier now.
     

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