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How Big is a 17 Month Old Yellow Rat???

Discussion in 'Ratsnakes' started by poomwah, Feb 26, 2014.

  1. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    I know, every snake is different and the difference can be vast. I'm looking for an average here.
    A female yellow rat, 17 months old, I'm just wondering what a realistic expectation would be of its size, both length and weight.
     
  2. Wyldrose

    Wyldrose Elite Member

    Cornsnakes are also known as red rat snakes(I have never seen a yellow rat in person). My 18 month ish corns are in the 150 gram range and about 2-2.5 feet long. About as thick as one of your fingers.
     
  3. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    that's kind of what I was expecting :[
    I bought a yellow rat, its 17 or 18 months old (the breeder isn't sure of the exact date but narrowed it down between two months), I was expecting quite a bit more than what I got. Especially for the price.
    19.3 inches long and 29grams :[
    20140219_131216_zpslhainpzh.jpg
     
  4. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    and he refused to eat last night :[ I've had him a week and this is the first time he's been offered food. Normally I don't worry about one missed feeding. But I've never had a rat snake refuse food.
     
  5. trappen

    trappen Elite Member

    If you have only had him a week I would give him more time alone with no handling a while longer so he can get use to his new place.
     
  6. JoeyG

    JoeyG Subscribed User Premium Member

    Sounds funny to me. If it's a breeder how does he not know the age of the animal... 29 grams seems awfully light for a snake that age. Are you sure it's bred and not WC? For now I would say leave it alone for at least a whole week before any further feeding attempts. Try then, good luck!
     
  7. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    thanks guys, I'll leave her alone for another week and try again.

    I can't say for sure about the cb vs wc, just that the breeder sold her as a captive bred hatched in either august or september of 2012.

    I've questioned the size with the breeder but am still waiting to hear what he has to say about it. If anything.
    All I know is that if I had known what I was getting, there's no way I would have bought her, especially for the price I paid.
    I can definitely tell you that from seeing this pic
    1468041_zpslbcshcfv.jpg
    and with her her supposed age, I was definitely not expecting this
    20140219_120407_107046_zpsuxxbwqsn.jpg
    20140219_131233_zpsfhun0cwc.jpg
    The guy is a reputable breeder and people rave about him, but I feel like I got ripped off.
     
  8. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    I heard back from the dealer and he said there's nothing wrong with the size. That he feeds him a pinkie every 7 to 10 days and "We seem to grow them up at similar rates that I observe in wild rat snakes in my field work down here"
    so, I guess I'm out of luck.
    I did something interesting for comparison, overlayed two pictures. I took a pic of two different snakes in the same tub. Then I matched up the "frosted" circles on the bottom of the tub to make the scale accurate. In one pic, the "normal" sized 17 or 18 month old yellow rat, fed every 7 to 10 days, currently 19.3 inches long and 29grams. The other picture, George, my white side black rat, 19 months old, fed every wednesday, currently up to rat pup size. 39.5 inches 261 grams!
    how's this for a "normal" sized 17 month old yellow rat.... think he'll grow close to George's size by the time he's that age....in a month or two at the most??? I KINDA doubt it.
    smallsnake_zpsda758b63.jpg
     
  9. JoeyG

    JoeyG Subscribed User Premium Member

    So basically he just said he under feeds them.... maybe he does it to keep his costs down. Personally I think its a shame to do that to an animal. What field work does he do, is he some sort of biologist?.... I don't think I would be buying from him again
     
  10. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    I definitely won't be. It goes beyond this size issue too.
    The guy tells me about a yearling yellow rat female he has, sends me a link to an ad with a picture of a GORGEOUS snake, we instantly fell in love with. It turned out to be a picture like ugly chicks use on dating sites. The ones that look great until you actually meet them.
    Anyway, the ad was for one female, had no idea he even had male yearlings. But when we went to pay, he wouldn't sell her to us unless we bought a male too. Said we could either buy a pair, or just a male. I reminded him about the deal we made, asked him why it changed. I posted something on fauna's BOI about it, and he agreed since we loved the snake so much, he would honor the original deal. I know I should have bailed at that point, but the guy had really good feedback on there, and we were really in love with that picture. Its too bad she looks VERY bland and boring in person, not to mention of course how small she is.
    I had asked about her size before purchasing her, but never got an answer, I did however while waiting for the answer get told that we had to buy her THAT day or she was going to a reptile show the next.
    Yeah, DEFINITELY won't be dealing with him again.
     
  11. JoeyG

    JoeyG Subscribed User Premium Member

    Sorry dude, I think you should post about who he is because that was all uncalled for and IMHO very unethical! No legit breeder will ever try to avoid question or change the deal. If he's on Fuana then leave a review about him
     
  12. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    I wasn't sure what the forum rules were about posting names of people and businesses.
    The business name is on the photo though :p
    He advertises on kingsnake.com but there are lots of Good Guy threads on fauna's Board of Inquiry.
    I made a post on there, some people were cool, but some got ****ed that I'd say something bad about them. Some also said on there that the snake is normal size for its age. can you believe it.
    Inquiry Sunshine Serpents - FaunaClassifieds
     
  13. JoeyG

    JoeyG Subscribed User Premium Member

    Sorry man, to me a deal is a deal even if only verbal. Takes all kinds
     
  14. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    Thanks Joey
    I think the worst part of it really is not the fact that I got ripped off. My wife isn't really into snakes and she fell in love with the snake in the picture. We were all excited about it, but my wife was utterly thrilled. She finally wanted a snake.
    She was so excited when fed ex got here ,but then got really worried about how small the box was. Then we opened the box and I watched her face when she saw the snake.
    She was beyond disappointed. Then the kids got home from school, they were so excited about getting the new snake that they tried to talk me into letting them stay home from school so they could be there when Belt got home(yes we named her before we even got her). They came rushing in asking if she was home yet. Then they saw her, they were so disappointed. My daughter even asked "why didn't we get Belt?" I even had to ask the dealer if we got the right snake. It was that inaccurately depicted.
    That's the part that really sucks. I hate losing money, especially when someone else benefits from my loss. But I can get more money. Getting my families hopes up like that and then disappointing them so much, that's the part that really has me upset.
    I'm sorry for whining so much, it's just, I can make more money, I cant take back the disappointment i saw in my family's faces.
     
  15. JoeyG

    JoeyG Subscribed User Premium Member

    I completely understand! I think if something was represented and it was drastically different then they are in the wrong. If I knew more about ratsnakes I could point you in a better direction but I don't.... I still don't see how he can claim their size in the wild!
     
  16. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    he apparently is an avid "field herper" and runs a big reptile business.
    what I really don't understand is the people on fauna that are saying there's nothing wrong with the snake and I should be happy about it. of how they can say that the size of the snake is normal .
    I wish so bad I could put links to other forums on there, this one for example with people backing me up, or theres another forum I'm on where yellow ratsnake owners voiced their opinions and backed them up with photos.
    But I can't post ANY of that stuff because fauna considers it "anonymous third hand information and it has no place on the BOI"
    "the burden of proof is on the seller"
    I can find a dozen people who know rat snakes that will say its ridiculously small, but unless they are on fauna and using their "real" names, I can use it to prove my point. I even got reprimanded by a mod for even saying that there were people on other forums that said the snake was small.
    I'm baffled
     
  17. TitoAndKatt

    TitoAndKatt Elite Member

    While I understand your frustration I do want to add that she is a beautiful snake. She may be small now but with time and proper care I think she'll grow into what you originally wanted. Her colors are really nice. :)
     
  18. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    thanks Tito. I'm sure she'll grow if I can ever get her to eat , lol. Going to try again today actually.
    Do you think her being fed so little, obviously if she's anywhere near the age claimed, she must have been fed a very small amount to keep her as small as she is. Anyway, think that would have an effect on her overall size later? Can their growth be stunted as a result?
    Also, what do you guys think about a snake going a long time unhandled? Do you think that has an effect on them? The reason I ask, as is to be expected, she came from a breeder that had an extremely large collection and as such didn't have time to handle the animals. So, she's obviously very shy and nervous. She needs to be worked with carefully so that she can become more accustomed to being handled. I can't do that with a snake this small. My hands and fingers are kinda messed up and I don't have the feeling or coordination to safely handle such a small snake.
    Will leaving her alone other than feeding and cleaning for about six months cause a problem for the snake? Or will it make it that much worse for her when I finally start working with her?
     
  19. TitoAndKatt

    TitoAndKatt Elite Member

    Can you have your family handle her in the meanwhile? It might help them get over their disappointment and start to bond with her too. :) It is better to start young, but I doubt it would do too much harm, especially if you at least take the time to sit with your hand in her cage so she can get used to you and the idea that hands are safe. It may just take longer to get her used to handling. When we got Pluto he was nothing but a tiny worm and terrified of humans. I don't think he was being handled very nicely as the store employees were all afraid of him. He was free bc he was considered unsellable, a vicious, uncurable biter. :( He was simply scared. While he is still super active and fidgety, he is used to people and enjoys coming out to explore.
    Anyways, it would be best to avoid handling her for a while regardless to let her settle in. She has just been through quite the ordeal. I'm not so surprised she isn't eating yet. Give her a few days to a week to settle in and try again. Hopefully by then she will be nice and hungry as well as feeling more secure in her new environment.
     
  20. poomwah

    poomwah Well-Known Member

    Thank you for the hand in the cage idea, I was hoping that would work :]
    Unfortunately I can't get the family to help on this one. They won't go near her, LOL. I keep telling them that it won't hurt if they get bitten and that if they are careful that they won't get bitten. NO LUCK, lol. They just arent' ready for that kind of thing. The kids are a little picky about which snakes she holds, she's great with the calm babies, great with George and Chinga (baby northern pine, but very calm) they won't go near Belt Loop or Norma Jean (baby bull snake with typical bull snake attitude). And my wife doesn't like handling them, let alone being the one to get them out.
    I did give her a week to settle in before trying to feed her. I've left her alone for another 5 days after that except for getting her out once long enough to get a picture. Did you mean give her up to a week after getting her or up to a week from now?
    The Pluto story sounds a lot like George. He wasn't free but they had him seriously marked down because he was "aggressive" and nobody there liked to get him out. The bravest one in the store opened the cage and reached in and LITERALLY started poking at him. Of course the snake would jump. Wouldn't kiss, strike or gape, he'd just jump. I told the guy to stop, and kinda pushed my way in between him and the cage and reached right in, took George out and looked him over. They employees were staring in amazement.
    He's a great snake, he, like Pluto is super active and fidgety, but he's actually only struck at me once, and it was TOTALLY my fault. I thought he was awake, he wasn't and I startled him. Just a quick over his "shoulder" strike, then saw me and started tongue flicking and climbing on my hand.
     

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