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Discussion in 'Product Questions' started by graduationxday, Aug 7, 2008.

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  1. graduationxday

    graduationxday Elite Member

    Anyone ever bought a live animal from here?
    This is mostly for curiosity's sake, but I may get a couple things from here in the future.
    I just wanted to know if anyone has any experience with this site.
  2. tuffgi2001

    tuffgi2001 Elite Member

    You CANNOT buy from HaHaReptile. They are a wholeseller. They only sell to pet shops. You can however buy from That is the parent company of hahareptile. I have not bought from them, but I was going to. Decided against it. The critters I wanted to buy are caught in the wild, not captive bred. I would check to make sure a critter is captive bread.
  3. zaroba

    zaroba Elite Member

    I think you can buy from them, I just went through the whole checkout up to the credit card input and saw nothing forcing a person to have a business (most retail shop only places will require a tax id # ). They have a minimum purchase of $200 though.
  4. tuffgi2001

    tuffgi2001 Elite Member

    Exactly. I called them to order some Horny Toads. They told me they will only sell to pet stores. You have to buy at least 200 bucks of a certain item or what not. You can call them too, that is what they told me. They then directed me to You will notice though that they have the same phone number as
  5. graduationxday

    graduationxday Elite Member

    Ohhhh I didn't know that. Haha.

    Well, is any good? x]
  6. untsmurf

    untsmurf Elite Member

    I wouldn't buy from them. Any company that is willing to sell wc animals is no good in my book. It's good that they inform you about it, but I wouldn't feel comfortable buying an animal that comes with this description:
    "These snakes are imported into the United States by the thousands. Most will not eat due to stress and internal parasites. They also are covered in huge ticks
    which, must be removed.

    Reptile City treat each wild caught Ball Python for worms and expect each snake for ticks before shipping."

    That just doesn't seem right to me.
  7. MoogleBass

    MoogleBass Kittes are so nice! Premium Member

    I know most people will disagree with me on this. Why look down on companies that sell WC animals?
    I for one would love to have alot of animals that I could only get by being WC. Then you get new bloodlines in with your animals also. I've heard stories from WC bps, that alot are gorgeous. I for one would love to see some of the WC Bps.
  8. untsmurf

    untsmurf Elite Member

    What species could you only get if it were WC?
  9. MoogleBass

    MoogleBass Kittes are so nice! Premium Member

    Most of them are geckos. Heres some

    Eublepharis macularius afghanicus
    Eublepharis macularius fasciolatus
    Eublepharis macularius macularius
    Eublepharis macularius montanus
    Eublepharis macularius smithi
    Hemitheconyx taylori
    A few Phelsuma

    Thats all I can think of.

    E. m. afghanicus are just starting to be breed. Not to many out there though. :)

    Why look down on companies that sell WC?
  10. JIQRP

    JIQRP Active Member

    I agree with buying CB reptiles if at all possible.:)
  11. MoogleBass

    MoogleBass Kittes are so nice! Premium Member

    Yes I agree buying CB is better for most. If its something your looking for like a hard to find gecko, or so. Then WC is the way to go. There are also alot of awesome WC retics. They are just amazing looking.
  12. untsmurf

    untsmurf Elite Member

    Eublepharis macularius is a leopard gecko which is being bred all over everywhere in captivity. There are several available morphs that were not WC.

    My problem with WC animals is that they are flooding the market and driving down the prices for legitimate breeders. Also, their temperaments tend to be worse than a cbb baby herp. My big problem however there are so many wonderful animals that need adoption from rescues and owners that can no longer keep their herps, but due to the flooding of WC herps in the market people are less likely to adopt, leaving these perfectly good animals to die in a rescue.

    It's also illegal to grab animals from the wild and try to domesticate them. I know it's illegal for certain species, not if it's illegal for all species though.

    Basically, there isn't a NEED to have WC animals in our markets. If we support them it will bring down prices for the breeders (who will not be able to cover the costs of legitimately breeding the animal in the first place, resulting in fewer breeders and fewer cb animals), not to mention WC animals are often times infected with multiple diseases.

    It's just bad business all around.

    Wanting an animal that has the same spots but on a different part of the body, is not a reason to flood the market (or support those who do) with WC animals.

    Sorry for rambling and having unconnected thoughts, but I've had a long day and I'm tired.;)
  13. MoogleBass

    MoogleBass Kittes are so nice! Premium Member

    Did I mention a common Eublepharis macularius? I mentioned subspecies. There is a difference.

    Lets see here. If the rescue lets the animals die in their care. Well thats not a rescue is it now? Most will not take it in to let it die. They will raise it till it dies or needs put down due to medical reasons. Also there are some rescues, for say dogs, cats, and birds that WILL NOT sell to you if you plan to breed them. Most city shelters will spay/neuter them so you can't breed them. My guess is the same thing goes for some rescues of reptiles too. I doubt they want more iguanas out there.

    Sorry you can not domesticate a reptile.

    To say there isn't a need for WC animals in the market, well I disagree. You keep breeding the same animals back and back over again. You will get problems. Yes reptiles can suffer from deforms. Just like a person can. It may take longer. It will happen. So to say nah, what we got is good enough. Isn't the right thing. That and most bloodlines now are not pure. So If I wanted to introduce new blood, ya I could go to a new breeder, but what if there was a new fresh bloodline. I personally would like to use that and see what could happen.

    So because I want a gecko or a snake that is not breed that means I just have to suffer cause it will flood the market if I import 2 or 3 of them for me?

    Yes you have to have papers to go out and capture animals from the wild for exportation. Those can be granted easily depending on where you are. Some places you can for get it though. I am just glad that some one has Hoplodactylus and Naultinus in captive. Cause well you can't get them from the wild. They won't let you. OH wait, cause they have WC that means they are going to flood the market.
  14. Bigtyny

    Bigtyny Active Member

    wc are good for bring new blood in reptiles like the ones that are inbred and many breeders need new bloodlines but by no means do I feel they are for new keepers this goes for almost every water turtle. cb for newbies. leo morphs are all inbred to make Ron Tremper as in albino leos ron inbred to get some of that blood it took along time for new blood to come in. Veiled Chameleons same thing Ron was the first to breed he comes from my home town they were inbred bad wc give large babys few eggs but there alot bigger and they bring new blood there are alot of herps doing bad because of inbreeding and people are crossing them and making stupid hybreds. lace montors Australia will not export and I know alot of breeders need new blood for them and till we have new blood alot of animals will die off.
  15. untsmurf

    untsmurf Elite Member

    I realize there is a difference in subspecies. But in general you are talking about leos. And I'm sorry but if you can't get a gecko/snake that you want, you aren't suffering. You just can't get it. Get another one. Their exactly the same, just different appearances. Unless you are actually planning on breeding for different morphs then there's not a whole lot of difference between them.

    And when I said they have to die in a rescue, I did not mean that the rescue will mistreat or ignore the animal until it died. I meant that the animal would either die from illness/old age or would be put down due to over crowding. And yes there are shelters that will not allow you to adopt an animal for breeding purposes. We got one of our dogs from a shelter like that and I think it's wonderful because I believe the dog/cat population is already too big. But that's another topic altogether.

    And when I said domesticate a WC animal, I meant "to adopt or make fit for domestic use or life" which is what we do when we put our herps in cages all around our houses for our viewing pleasures and get them accustomed to people.

    The problems you are talking about with bloodlines I don't really feel there is an issue. There are plenty of herps in the market with different bloodlines for breeding purposes. Now, if you're talking one guy out of his garage breeding two herps and then breeding the children and their children and so on and so forth, then yes, that's a problem. But no responsible breeder would do that. And again, responsible breeding is another issue entirely.

    And I'm sad to hear how easy it is to legally capture wild animals. I wish they made the rules stricter. Humans have a way of over doing things and we've already wiped out enough species in my opinion.

    And just one additional note, I don't want this to turn into a fight. I'm putting forth my opinions specifically for the purpose of having a healthy debate. I respect the opinions of others and I expect others to do the same with mine. So lets keep it civil.

    Have a good day :)
  16. Rich

    Rich Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    Actually, some of the largest leopard gecko breeders in the country, including Ron Tremper, do exactly that! They inbreed certain leopard gecko morphs to help bring out the trait. They do so by breeding offspring to parent for several generations. That is how alot of the morphs on the market had been created to begin with.

    I am not a WC fan for those who care to know. I am not against wild caught animals though. In fact, we actually DO need them in this hobby. I am not referring to those bringing in thousands of ball pythons each week and then flipping them out though.

    At some point in time, EVERY reptile being bred in captivity was wild caught. If we expect there to be new reptiles within the hobby, someone is going to have to breed some WC specimens and get the ball rolling.

    Being against mass importing of WC animals is understandable, and something I am against as well. Bringing in new bloodlines and different species though I am not against and do not believe for a second will flood the market.
  17. untsmurf

    untsmurf Elite Member

    So then if they're purposely breeding them this way to get the morphs, shouldn't your argument be against morph breeding???

    I'm not against WC 100% either. I understand the need for a few for research and possible breeding. Just not by the masses. It should be done by a responsible person for these specific reasons, not just for profit (by capturing and reselling 100s) or for the common person that sees something outside and decides to "rescue it".
  18. Rich

    Rich Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    Not at all. Not every morph is created this way and maintaining the line isn't done this way typically. (Though I do suspect some still inbreed their own leos instead of purchasing new blood.)

    I myself breed leopard geckos and have been doing so for many years now. I introduce new blood into my colony almost every year. I know many others who do as well. With the masses of leos having been produced or started from the same parents somewhere down the line, technically the vast majority of leos being bred are related in some way.

    This was simply the point I was trying to bring to the forefront of this discussion. Introducing new bloodlines from WC specimens is actually needed. Arguing if morphs should be created this way is another discussion. This one was just about WC animals. ;)
  19. Bigtyny

    Bigtyny Active Member

    I do see there is no need to bring in ball pythons or other herps in the mass I dont like it but I do think some should in small groups so not to take all of the wilds animals. when I was talking about blood lines I mean female is not related to the male alot of breeders do this I have seen it first hand with top breeders and I think the best way to stop getting so many imports is to start breeding more I think this will stop alot of the trade of animals that are wc getting in to the states.
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