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Bearded Dragons and Water

Discussion in 'Bearded Dragons' started by Skunk, Apr 12, 2010.

  1. emogaljaime

    emogaljaime Active Member

    I have a pair of beardy's and we never see them drink their water but we set up a recorder with a view on the bowl and after a few hours of filming the male jumped to the water bowl and had a drink. I've decided that they just don't like having people watch them drink. Also as you are generally bathing them in luke warm water, it's not a very good idea to let them drink it as it's not treated.
     
  2. jeepguy

    jeepguy Elite Member

    What treatment are you talking about for their drinking water?
    Gary
     
  3. emogaljaime

    emogaljaime Active Member

  4. Merlin

    Merlin Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    The dechlor, while not harmful, is unnecessary. I have used straight tap water for all my reptiles for years.
     
  5. emogaljaime

    emogaljaime Active Member

    but you never know if something goes wrong with the water in your area and it gets contaminated. It's happened to me before
     
  6. Merlin

    Merlin Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    Contaminated by what? Dechlor removes chlorine and chloramines. It will not remove contaminates.
     
  7. kaitala

    kaitala Active Member

    I wish I had the time to look for the sources, but I've been informed that many animals, including P. vittaceps can and do absorb water by soaking. Not through their skin, as one would think, however, but through their vent. That does honor the theory that if one can absorb through a pathway, one can lose through the same pathway. :)

    Also, remember that there are plenty of "one way" and selective/regulatory membranes and structures in nature, from organelles to organs (nutrients are absorbed by the body in the small intestine, but not lost), and to man-made valves, etc. Plants can selectively take in or exhale water and water vapor through their leaves, and can do so selectively, to an extent, through the stomata, yet don't absorb water through the actual surface of the leaf. When dealing with Mother Nature, it seems there is nothing as simple as we'd like to make it! (I. e. if you can absorb water through an organ, you lose water at the same rate with no control through the same organ.)

    Regardless of whether or not they will drink or will bathe, with all the legislation and hypervigilance against reptile keepers, I would say it is at least in the OWNER's best interest to keep clean fresh water available at all times. I have yet to see an exception written into cruelty statutes that "clean fresh water" need NOT be available to any pet. (please post if you know of said exceptions) You could keep a Sand Golem (fictitious creature, lol) who would dissolve on contact with liquid, and some humane officer would interpret the statute literally, instead of in kind with what you're keeping and give you at least a warning, if not worse. And an appropriately sized bowl of water should not raise the humidity level to a detrimental level, when environmental controls are in place.

    Just my 2cents.

    :)
     
  8. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

     
  9. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

    I`ve also used/use water straight from the tap, so far I haven`t had any problems with any of my reptiles (or other animals), because of the chlorine in over 25 years.
     
  10. DarrylKensley

    DarrylKensley Active Member

    Wow this thread is just full of digs. -_-
     
  11. Merlin

    Merlin Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    Correcting posted misinformation is not a "dig".
    Its just keeping things on the straight and narrow.
     
  12. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

    Everyone is entitled to their opinion, but when that opinion is incorrect, it`s important that the known facts are put forward, these debates/discussions concern the animal/s health and welfare, no response that I`ve made on any topic should be taken as a personal insult against any individual.
    The animals are the only consideration.
     
  13. DarrylKensley

    DarrylKensley Active Member

    Gosh I messed my my words again!

    I meant arrogance. :p
     
  14. DarrylKensley

    DarrylKensley Active Member

    On topic though.

    Whilst being in water isnt 'natural' as proven in the original post Beardies and still drink, swim, 'absorb'* amongst other things in water.

    However, I dont think they naturally hang out on resin rocks or tissue paper with plastic plants either but hey ho, I might be wrong!

    I have just spent 20 mins researching and it appears there is no 'solid' answer. In fact I am finding more evidence of absorption and vent theories than I am of theories against the 2...

    I have contacted a couple of specialist Reptile experts and a Reptile Biologist to end this. Will post up results, if and when I get em. :)
     
  15. murrindindi

    murrindindi Elite Member

    There`s no arrogance in correcting a mistake, except on the part of the inexperienced keeper/s who cannot accept said mistake!
    Show your evidence.....
     
  16. Merlin

    Merlin Administrator Staff Member Premium Member

    Exactly how is it arrogant to correct someone who is wrong? Nobody is calling anyone names or flaming them.
    Being in water can be "natural" it just isn't as common for them to find it in their arid wild habitat. That does not mean that they would not enter standing water or even drink from it if they found it. But that doesn't mean that they need a large tub of water standing in their enclosure raising the humidity level to that of a rainforest dweller either. Its all about considering the way that they live in the wild.
    And what does that have to do with anything? We keep them in captivity but should attempt to supply them with the conditions in which they have evolved.

    And if I look long enough I can find all sort of silliness on websites that have absolutely no foundation in either science or sense!

    Why is it so hard for you to consider the fact that you might be wrong?

    Based on the basic beginner's questions you ask, you are a novice. However you insist on arguing with people who have decades of experience keeping reptiles.
     
  17. DarrylKensley

    DarrylKensley Active Member

    hehe I am indeed a novice.

    But my Zard is in awesome health, growing well, has lovely skin (due to the lovely baths maybe?) so I couldn't care less.

    I have only asked questions about my heating for instance because I am concerned about getting the best set up possible. All I get though is, 'Use a normal light-bulb' Ooooh yeah because that looks professional.

    Ive had him for 2 years and the condition I received him in was dia. I wouldnt say I was a novice, but hey ho!

    Again wordplay. I know there are water pot holes in Aus...

    I was being sarcastic...

    And one last thing, the arrogance comes from the fact that a lot of peoples posts have this 'And thats that, I am right, dont reply' tone to them.

    That, sucks.

    This forum is supposed to be the best? So far all I have seen is a couple of know-it-alls telling everyone that they are wrong and offering nothing but "I have had reptiles for years" mumbo.

    That doesnt cut it for me.

    I joined this community to get involved but it looks like I wont be staying because of a few that like to come across like they are the point to the triangles.

    "Show you evidence"

    I like the fact some of you answer questions with ignorance and another question.
     
  18. DarrylKensley

    DarrylKensley Active Member

    Sorry to OP for messing up the thread, a mod is more than welcome to remove my posts once the birds of the vultures of the forum have soaked it up and gotten annoyed at me.
     
  19. Skunk

    Skunk Active Member


    This is completely wrong, ask any herp vet, they'll laugh (but I can see how you would think it's possible)

    Some beardies may drink/swim, but this is likely due to them being a cross with a more coastal dwelling Pogona.
     
  20. kaitala

    kaitala Active Member

    Through their vents??? ;) LOL

    Just a few references for you all:

    Another preferred method would be by bathing in shallow, warm (not hot!) water for 15-20 minute periods. Beardies absorb water through their vent area which is an opening on the underside of their tail. This is the way that we've always watered our beardies.


    Gecko Information - Bearded Dragon Care Sheet

    http://chesapeakebayreptiles.com/CARESHEET.html

    The Reptile Rack Knowledgebase / Bearded Dragon Care Sheet

    Cryptic Dragons

    Those are just some of the resources I've found with a quick search. This is either one heck of a bearded dragon "urban myth" or there is something to it. :)

    Skunk, I know your intent was to help demonstrate why they don't "naturally need" water. However, sometimes, one must question the author of articles and the author's knowledge of the topics.

    "Rick" of the other forum who authored the article seems to be flawed in some of his math, and also uses limited data manipulated to support his hypothesis that "Dragons don't need a water source".

    Some of the flaws that I see (and these are my own interpretations of the data, from my knowledge of science, if anyone can demonstrate how my reasoning is flawed, please enlighten me, and "Show your Sources" ;) ) are related to his interpretation of the meteorological data, and some underlying principles that seem to be ignored.

    "Rick" writes:
    A bit of quick math’s shows that total rainfall in these three months is 34.2 mm BUT evaporation has been at the rate of a massive 1184.8 mm. Given that only 34.2 mm fell this means that another 1150.6 mm of standing water would have evaporated in those three months.

    Rick first made the mistake of assuming that when water evaporates, it is no longer available in the environment. If you look at the column marked "%RH" that is the column for RELATIVE HUMIDITY. While there may be a high rate of evaporation, that water is not completely removed from the environment, it is *evaporated* into the air, contributing to the Relative Humidity.

    While the mean relative humidity was overall low, 26% at 9 am in Feb and 16% at 3 pm in Feb, the max relative humidity was 76% and 58%!!!! There are periods of high humidity there in the outback!

    Rick did also not use data from evening. Incomplete research can be used to demonstrate almost anything one would like. Just pick and choose the data that supports your argument and you have "proof".

    No dew points were given, nor were rates of condensation. Therefore, he did not take into account, and did not allow us to consider, condensation of atmospheric moisture. Dragons would be able to lap this condensed moisture.

    And pics of his brother-in-law and sister-in-law have little to do with bearded dragons. Warnings for humans have little to do with bearded dragons. Writing in this manner makes me question his credibility further. It is not meant to demonstrate the natural behavior of dragons, but as "proof" that there "is no water, so you don't have to give your dragons any."

    And why was no scientific study OF dragons included in his research? Why was there not a ONE pic of dragons in situ? I didn't see any dragons in the pics he posted, apparently they don't find that environment hospitable and reside where there IS some water. ;)

    Again, I wish I had time to go into this in more detail, but offline life has many things requiring my attention. I look forward to hearing other's input on this matter.

    Remember, just as some didn't accept the argument, without "proof", that dragons absorb water through their vents, we don't have to accept everything that others say as gospel, just because they use pseudoscience and an authoritative tone. Please, go back, and reread the stats and interpret them for yourselves. See if anything else is lacking in the Original Repost from the other forum. Post more questions about the "research" done by "Rick". Together, perhaps we can come up with something much more viable than "Rick's" one-sided, sophomoric interpretation of limited data!

    Have a great day, all!


    :)
     

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