As I now decided that it's better to get just one cornsnake,I start to wonder if it's ok getting two BPs for one cage.The breeder recommended me to get two,'cause they like to be together.He said even two boys together would be fine.I know he is a very serious breeder and he is not out for the money.He loves his snakes very much,I could tell when I had two long phonecalls with him!Now I'd like to know what you all think about housing them together.If you would say it's better to keep them seperate,I could only take one as my space is limited.I have to keep my snakes in my workroom,and there is room for only three big terrariums,and I want that corn!!I will build three terrariums: my sinaloan will have a new one : 3'4"x2' and about 2'high. The corn will get 4'x2' and 4'high (cause they love to climb!)
And if two boy -bps would really be ok,they would get 4'x3'8" and 3' high.What do you think now about two boys together?

I personally wouldn't buy two unless you have a spare tank in case they don't get on.

We had our two males together and found that they didn't get on, and therefore had to separate them.

Males and females will get on, however they will breed, so unless you are prepared for that it is not ideal. Two females may be fine together, particularly if they have been together since being young, however I think two males may cause problems, as when they reach sexual maturity they can become quite territorial, and even if they didn't fight they may cause each other stress - our two males didn't fight, in fact they wouldn't go anywhere near each other, and had a loss of appetite.

While the breeder may genuinely care for his animals, I do not think it was best to strongly advise you to get two males. I would stick to one for now, and perhaps if you decide in future that you have enough space you could get another and try them together, however you would need a spare tank in case they didn't get on.

Those tank sizes are extremely large by the way - a corn doesn't need anything near that size, and although a lot of the time more is better, with BPs large tanks can cause stress, and smaller enclosures will make the snake feel more secure and will lead to a healthier, happier snake.

Good luck with whatever you decide, and keep us updated

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"If you know everything you may as well blow your brains out because the reason for existence is to learn more everyday." - Mark O'Shea, 2004

I wouldn't advise keeping two BPs together regardless of sex, as they are solitary animals, and you may experience all sorts of problems. Is this your first snake? Or first BP? BPs can be stressful at the best of times, I would recommend you just get one for now.

Those tanks are way too big - in my opinion you should make the enclosures much smaller, and then you will have room for more snakes in the future if you decide to expand

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I'll think of something to put here soon.......

You said those tank sizes are way too big-what would you recommend then??!Thanks for your answers.In books about bps I read about a minimum size for tanks,but they also say the bigger the better,because bps are very active at night.This book was written by a guy who studied biology and is a german snake expert.I noticed that American snake keeping is diffrent from Europe,here many herpologists say the bigger the tank the better,and the Americans keep it very small. How come?I personally think that if the snake has enough hiding places,it doesn't really matter if the tank is very big.Does anybody know if this is proven that a snake is more stressed out in a large tank?I spend hours reading about snakes and how to care for them,but there are so many sites that tell diffrent stories.I'm at a point where I don't know what's right and what's wrong,it's very confusing!! I really thought that if I gave my snakes enough space to roam around they will be much happier! I keep my sinaloan in a 2'8"x1'8"x1'8"
(80cmx50cmx50cm).I have her now since January 17, 2005, and she is only about 1'6"long (45cm).She went through an amazing change in that short time-since about 2 weeks she is very tame and doesn't "run away" anymore when I get her out.Do you think that tank is too big? Would love to know what you think! Thanks!

Well actually I am from England, and we don't neccessarily believe that smaller enclosures are best, but for some snakes they are, and I am speaking from personal experience.

The average recommendation for a tank is that it should be 2 thirds the length of the snake, so if a snake is 6ft long the tank should be 4ft long. Although bigger can be better, and some snakes are very active and need the space, others can become stressed by larger spaces. Our blood python for example is a very shy species of snake and when she was smaller we had her in a more open enclosure,. she wouldn't eat for us, however when we moved her to a smaller enclosure she eats every week without trouble. Blood pythons are very shy, lazy snakes, and even if lots of hides were provided, can often become stressed in a larger enclosure.

It also depends on the individual snake ofcourse - some BPs might be ok in a larger tank, others might not do well. You might find that your BP is not too shy and does well in a larger space, or you might find that it won't eat, becomes shy and aggressive, and prefers a smaller space.

Besides this, i am simply recommending a smaller tank because the snake just doesn't need so much space. People often use the argument that snakes have all the space they want in the wild, but they do not slither around and travel the whole country in which they live - they often reside in a small area, and they will hunt, sleep and breed there, hiding away during the day and out and about in the small part of the land they inhabit at night.

A BP will grow to lengths of 3-5ft on average, females growing slightly larger than males, and are quite heavy bodied for their size. They are not aboreal so they do not need height, and are typically lazy snakes although they will come out at night. I personally would house a BP in something at maximum 3ft long x 2ft deep x 12-18" high, however we find that our BPs do better in smaller, darker enclosures, and our males are kept in a rack system where their boxes are about 2.5ft x 2ft.

I understand that you will find a lot fo conflicting research and advice on the net and in books - bare in mind that some books are quite old and although they can still be good references new research is being done all the time. Also, people will advise according to personal experience, which is what I am doing, and personal experiences will be different. Research is a must before buying something, however the best experience is personal experience.

Good luck, I hope you have found this useful,. bare in mind also that the breeder is suggesting you buy two male BPs - not a good idea, and I suspect he is suggesting this because it is harder to sell males and he needs to get rid of them.

FYI, I would recommend that the enclosure you have your sinaloan is absolutely fine, and for a single adult corn snake you are looking at a min. sized enclosure of 3ft x 1ft x 1ft, and a max (in my opinion) of 3ft x 2ft x 2ft, although again the snake doesn't need so much space, however corns are hardier and less shy than BPs, and will use the space more.

May I ask, why are you getting a corn and a BP? Have you thought about just getting one at a time so that you can devote your time to each one as they come?

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"If you know everything you may as well blow your brains out because the reason for existence is to learn more everyday." - Mark O'Shea, 2004

I am with Rachel. Stating that snakes need, or like, to be together is either anthropomorphosizing or just giving you a pitch to sell you a second snake. Either way,...he is mistaken. Snakes neither need nor desire company. And 2 males is the worst combination he could have suggested so I too suspect he is trying to unload extra males.
I would also urge you to go slowly. I know how exciting being bitten by the snake bug is (duh! me too!). But waiting till you have a bit more snake experience with one species would be preferable before you venture into another species. It is very easy for new keepers to quickly become overwhelmed when they immeditely dive in to multiple speces. I also agree the size of the cage you are proposing for the corn is far bigger than necessary. Even active snakes are not THAT active. They generally hole up in one spot and unless driven by need, (food,water, reproduction) they don't really move around that much.
And ball pythons are not that active, even at night. They will move around slowly and poke about but its not like they are going to run laps around the tank.

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Merlin,
What's Life Without A Little Magic!

Bitis and Merlin, I was told a corn could live in a 20 gallon long tank for its whole life...but it's only 30 inches long. Is that long enough for corns, or am I going to need to get a longer tank as they grow?

Jacky, as far as cage height goes and speaking for myself, I would be very worried putting a corn snake in an enclosure as high as the one you described. While they do climb, they are primarily terrestrial snakes, and I found that my clumsy hatchlings fell as often as they climbed. When they fell, they fell hard even from a height of only a foot, which scared me to death since the snakes were so little. I don't know how often snakes become injured from falls, but I couldn't stand thinking that they might hurt themselves, and I switched to much lower climbing things...branches that are way longer than they are high. I'd be terrified even an adult corn might get a real injury falling from something as high as 4 feet! My 20 gallon long tanks are only a foot high, and the snakes' long climbing branches are only about half that height. They seem to enjoy them quite a lot.......it appears to me that my snakes like to move along the length of a branch more than they like to travel upward.

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~Juliane~

Thanks for your answers.I'm not getting the corn and the bp at the same time.The corn I will get within the next 2 weeks or so(as soon as the cage is ready and running ok) and the bp is not even born yet ,the eggs are being laid sometime this month.So it will be 6-8month until I'm a bp owner,so that gives me time to get to know my corn. Finding a bp breeder around here is very difficult,and I don't want to buy a bp from a petstore,'cause they are all farmraised and I don't want that.Even some petstores say they are from breeders,most of the time it's not true.I was lucky to find two people who's bps are having babies,otherwise I could have waited two years.I was searching for them at the right time,because I didn't know that they only have babies from March through April/May,around here,anyway,and if you got a bp who is born in another month it sure is from a farm in Africa.That's what I was told anyway.

Jacky I'm not sure who told you that but they are blowing smoke at you! March and April is when the imported hatchlings show up, at least around here.

Juliane a 20 long will house an adult corn just fine.

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Merlin,
What's Life Without A Little Magic!

Yeah Julianne, your tank is fine for an adult corn.. I was speaking in general terms. So often people look at our 8.5ft long carpet python and tell us "but she can't stretch out in her tank because it's not 8.5ft long", however snakes don't tend to stretch right out, and don't need to, and therefore a tank that is only 3-4ft long and 4ft high works well for her. The maximum sized tank needed is recommended to be two-thirds the length of the snake.

Jacky, BPs will be produced throughout the year in captivity - the breeder can choose to put the males and females together whenever and can alter photoperiod and temps to make it so that winter is the snakes' spring, so that babies can be produced all year round. Often people will breed their snakes in the normal spring time, however this doesn't necessarily mean that they will be captive bred. There are times of the year when babies are more likely to be commonly sold, however snakes being available at a diff. time of the year doesn't necessarily mean it was farm bred either. Responsible people will inform you of farm-breeding and give you the option of buying the snake even though it has been farm bred. Just be careful - if possible ask to see the snake's parents, and check the snake for good health,.

Good luck.

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"If you know everything you may as well blow your brains out because the reason for existence is to learn more everyday." - Mark O'Shea, 2004